Posts by Ray Skyhorse

57

Doubt Not!

by silentlambs in

i thought you might like to see a fax i just sent to j. r. brown.

you can also pick it up on the front page of the website, you may also read and download the complaint that states the basis of this lawsuit.

run wt run...... silentlambs.

Thanks Bill for all of your hard work. My JW wife brings our little one to the meetings with her. I worry about him being molested. Your work gives me some comfort. Thank you for trying to make the world a safer place for kids.

Peace,
Ray

11

How I Married A Borg

by Ray Skyhorse in

ive been posting for about a month now.

ive finally finished writing about my life.

its long and complicated.

Ray Skyhorse

Thank you everyone for your encouraging thoughts and suggestions. I know that was a long post to read. When I read everyone’s replies this morning, it gave me such a good feeling inside -- the understanding, the compassion, the generosity is so heartwarming to me. Thank you all very much. I will gladly keep you updated as time goes on.

I know I have a long journey ahead of me. I know too that to be overtly confrontational with my wife would be disastrous. I must be like the constant drip of water on a piece of granite, slowly wearing it down over time. I feel that to take too aggressive of an approach would only lead to intense cognitive dissonance in her and would result in her pulling away from me.

I am definitely going to use the Borg's own materials against them. I plan on planting little seeds of doubt (truth) whenever I can. How do you suggest I do this? How can I do this in a nonchalant way? I don’t want her getting suspicious but I need to be planting small seeds of doubt on a continuous basis without making her defensive.

Francoise - I’m definitely planning on reading Franz’s book in the near future and the Hoffer book sounds very interesting. Does it touch on deprogramming methods?

Waiting - I’d like to know more about “The Red Tent”. How would her reading that book be beneficial? Would it make her question her programming? Or would it simply get her mind off of the Borg? She hasn’t read any fiction in a long, long time. The Borg has eaten away at her leisure time.

Jurs - Thank you for your encouragement. Your words give me hope. My situation seems somewhat similar to yours. Were you in the Borg a long time? Did your husband plant seeds of doubt or did you discover them on your own? I’ve heard it said that the longer somebody is in the Borg the harder it is to get them out. Thank you very much for your specific recommendation regarding the “Reasoning from Scriptures” book. It is knowledge from former members like this that I find invaluable.

Think41self - My wife is currently a homemaker. She does get out to do some extracurricular activities with other non-JW moms during the week so that is good. She used to work with non-JWs before our son came along. She associates quite a bit with “worldly” people. I encourage this as much as possible. I’d rather have her go to a gymboree class with our son than to go publishing.

Thank you,

Ray

11

How I Married A Borg

by Ray Skyhorse in

ive been posting for about a month now.

ive finally finished writing about my life.

its long and complicated.

Ray Skyhorse

Hello everyone. I’ve been posting for about a month now. I’ve finally finished writing about my life. It’s long and complicated. Life can be messy (especially when you’re a bisexual ex-Catholic married to a Borg).

This is the story of how I came to marry a Borg.

In the late 80’s I fell in love with a pretty, intelligent college woman. We went to UC XXXX together. I studied poli sci and she studied anthropolgy. We lived in the same dorm together for a time and we did lots of fun things together. She was very vivacious and funloving. We were a couple for about a year an a half. We were lovers and the best of friends. It was the best of times.

As graduation time drew close for me we broke up. I was the one who initiated the breakup. It was a stupid, immature thing to do. I think I did it because I thought life would be less complicated without a long distance relationship (I was moving back with my parents in Los Angeles). She dropped out of college and eventually decided to return to the mid-West, where she grew up.

I realized I was a fool for breaking up with her and I tried to reconcile with her. We both still loved each other but now we had a long distance relationship to deal with (in an era before email was common). But the distance turned out to be the least of our problems. She started studying the bible with some JWs whom she had met at work and she joined the Borg Collective.

I remember when she became Borg how she sent me a little book about evolution and creationism. She was a former anthro major -- I couldn’t believe she could believe this JW crap. We would spend hours on the phone with me trying to convince her of the falsehoods of her newfound faith. Eventually, she said that the elders told her to stop talking to me about their doctrines. Soon thereafter, we stopped talking to each other except for an occasional phone call every three months or so. We loved each other but she was Borg and I wasn’t. We remained friends, our friendship preserved by the memory of our love for each other. It was a very dark time for me. I ended up having a number of relationships with women that weren’t really emotionally fulfilling. I’m bisexual by nature (though I tend to prefer woman) and I had difficulty meeting women whom I could feel safe talking to about my sexuality. (My fear comes from my screwed up, anti-gay, sex negative attitude of a Catholic upbringing.) I abused alcohol and marijuana at this time. I abused these substances to numb the loneliness in my life. I continued to abuse these substances until only a couple of years ago.

In 1991 she married a fellow Borg. She married him because she was lonely. They were married for 5 years. She said she never loved him. They never had any kids together. They eventually divorced. She said that she never loved him. I don’t think either of them had an affair either. I don’t think either of them were DF’d, but I don’t know for sure.

During her marriage, she started getting some counseling and taking Prozac to deal with depression. She began to deal with child abuse issues that have plagued her since she was a little girl. Her mother and father are both alcoholics and her mother severely abused her both verbally and mentally as a small child. Her father turned a blind eye to the abuse. I think that this abuse turned her into a “Borg candidate”. I think that the Borg was attractive to this emotionally damaged woman. It gave her structure. It gave her rules to live by. These are things she never had as a child.

A short time after her divorce she called me. We hadn’t spoken since her marriage. I eventually went out to see her. She didn’t look good. She had lost a lot of weight and she was already a skinny gal to begin with. I was worried about her but I hoped that the worst was behind her. We spent a few days together. We even made love one night at the hotel I was staying at. It was a big surprise for me and I saw it a good sign that maybe she would leave the Borg. We talked about getting back together but she was still a Borg and I wasn’t. Times marches on. We keep in touch over the phone, only talking to each other every couple months or so. Each time we talked its like we are picking at the scab of our love. We knew we still loved each other, we knew there was hope. I continue dating other women and getting stoned a lot. During this time I even had a infrequent sexual relationship with my best (male) friend.

In 1999 a college friend of ours in California was getting married and I was invited. I debated whether to ask her to come as my guest and she said yes. It was wonderful seeing old friends again and having her at my side. It was like we were a couple again. Soon thereafter, she invited me and a few of our old college friends for a weekend to a condo in the Rockies that her mom has. One couple that came are in a mixed marriage -- Jewish and Catholic. We knew that they went through a lot of bullshit before they got married, but they overcame it. They brought their two little kids. They are so fantastic. They are being raised in the tradition of both religions. Seeing how they overcame their religious differences gave us the strength to overcome our differences.

About a month after this encounter, I invited her spend the weekend with me. In was a very romantic weekend in Santa Barbara. We went to the beach and we talked about marriage and how we would raise children. She agreed to let me celebrate everything that I’m used to celebrating and that our children could also celebrate these things. I agreed to let her take them to bible study. I proposed marriage and she accepted.

She came out to California and we got married. So far we've been married a year and half and we now have a 6 month old son. So far, life with her is better than life without her. True, she is Borg and is therefore not living life to its fullest. However, I’m not lonely anymore and have a beautiful son whom I love very, very much. I enjoy being a dad.

So why am I here posting ? My life sounds grand doesn’t it? Wrong. She developed a repulsion to oral sex!!! I think that oral sex is natural and I refuse to live without it. We both have enjoyed oral sex together over the years. Then about 6 months ago, around the time my son was born, I noticed that there was a decrease in the amount of oral sex we were having. I figured it was due the pregnancy -- we weren't having much sex anyway. However, when we starting engaging in sex again a few months after the pregnancy, there was no oral sex involved. I kind of ignored it at first but eventually, I realized that something was wrong. She just kept quite about it, like I wouldn’t notice or something. I told myself that the Borg must have screwed with my wife's sex program. I confronted my wife about it. She claimed she found the practice "revolting" and that she no longer wanted to have oral sex. I knew she was lying to me and to herself (based on our long sexual history together). I figured our marriage was headed to divorce. She was totally unwilling to compromise on the issue. I figured we would get divorced since I didn't want to be married to someone who couldn't compromise and because I didn't want to go without oral sex the rest of my life. A breakthrough came when she talked to the wife of an elder about the issue. It turns out that this wife of an elder and her husband had an issue with oral sex some time ago. They talked to a CO about it and he said it was ok for married people. After talking to this woman, my wife did 180 degree turn and said she like oral sex again. (If that's not proof she's in a cult, I don't know what is!)

Fortunately, this issue didn't destroy our marriage but it came pretty damn close. I now think of my wife as a ticking time bomb. When will the Borg doctrines hurt us next? I’m now determined to get her out of the Borg. I’m reading “Releasing the Bonds” by Steve Hassan and trying to develop a strategy to get her out. I know it may take a long time. Since I been on this website I’ve learned a lot of things. Knowledge is power and I’ve learned just how dangerous the Borg really is. I know I underestimated that danger factor because I was blinded by love. However I’m hoping that same love will give my wife and me strength we need to overcome her Borg programming.

Peace,

Ray Skythunder

24

Motives

by msil in

jw
friends

what are your motives for being here?.

1. to get information.

2. to slam the wtbs at every opportunity.

Ray Skyhorse

My motives are for
1
3
5 - emotional support (good one Mulan)
6 - To prevent my son from ever joining (his mother is Borg)

22

Divorce Policy of JWs

by Ray Skyhorse in

i have a general question about the policy of divorce.

i'm a not a jw.

can anybody get a divorce?

Ray Skyhorse

Cathy4school, thanks for sharing your story. What a horrible experience to go through. Did your ex and your "best friend" get married in a KH? Are you currently a Witness?

Your story makes me think about my own situation. When my wife broke up with her Ex neither of them had committed adultery. It makes me wonder how she and the JWs view my marriage. Witnesses believe that the new marriage should be viewed as invalid if I understand correctly. She and her congregation must be doing some heavy rationalizing in order to justify our marriage.

13

the new personality

by msil in

jw
friends

i would like to start a discussion thread as it relates to mind control and the tactics which are used.

"brothers, keep on putting on the new peronality..." - how well do you remember that?.

suggested discussions are:.

Ray Skyhorse

Welcome Msil. I'm a newbie as well. FYI there's a lot of information on this topic in the archives. If you do a search on "cult" you'll see that this subject has been covered.

I've just begun reading "Releasing the Bonds" by Steve Hassan and I hope to gain some insights on cults from his book and by talking to people here.

I am interested in this topic because I hope to plant seeds of doubt in my wife's mind. She's Borg. I was never one of them so I need to talk to former members in order to gain knowledge and insight. I need to develop strategies to get her out.

I encourage you to post anything you have to say about this topic. I'm all ears.

65

What does your username mean?

by closer2fine in

jw
friends

i was just wondering what everyone's username meant.

i have my own guesses (sixofnine, silentlambs, slayerlayer-i'm almost afraid :o), amazing-enough said!,mommy, fredhall-is that your name?, ozziepost-from downunder, and the list goes on!

please share!!

Ray Skyhorse

This is a fun question, closer2fine...

I use mine to hide my identity from my Borg wife. Not that she's ever gone to this website, but just in case...

Ray - by best friend's name
Sky - my son's name; also an indirect reference to Skywalker & Starwars
Horse - a variation of my real name

22

Divorce Policy of JWs

by Ray Skyhorse in

i have a general question about the policy of divorce.

i'm a not a jw.

can anybody get a divorce?

Ray Skyhorse

Expatbrit, it's funny you mention the six month penance. My wife didn't go to the KH for maybe 6 months after we got married. Do you think she might have been doing penance? How does one "do penance"?

22

Divorce Policy of JWs

by Ray Skyhorse in

i have a general question about the policy of divorce.

i'm a not a jw.

can anybody get a divorce?

Ray Skyhorse

That's interesting, RC. My wife and her ex are both JWs and I'm pretty damn sure that neither committed adultery. They did get a civil divorce and she married me in a civil ceremony a year and a half ago. How do the Witnesses view her and our marriage? Could she get in trouble with the elders for marrying me?

22

Divorce Policy of JWs

by Ray Skyhorse in

i have a general question about the policy of divorce.

i'm a not a jw.

can anybody get a divorce?

Ray Skyhorse

Ok, I'm getting confused. Let's use a hypothetical. A JW couple gets a civl divorce. Neither party committed adultery. How would the Borg treat them? Would they be Df'd if either of them get remarried?